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Post by BagLady on Jan 3, 2014 23:45:01 GMT -5
Guess! What do you think the "attorney's opinion" will be about the internet extortion fee!
Of one thing you can be sure--when put to the test--an attorney's opinion will be wrong 50% of the time!
While it is to the BOD's credit that they sought out a belated legal opinion, rather than serving up the usual Board Babble, it will not matter in the end. The internet fee is clearly not in accord with our Covenants and will be legally cH allenged if passed.
Further, it is my opinion that it is way past time to bring a breach of covenants legal cH allenge to these directors personally for K C N's presence on the property...regardless of the outcome of the internet vote. K C N has no authority to effectively take our common property to house its equipment and towers and conduct a business on the property contrary to the Covenants. If it were not present on the property, this extortion fee would never have come to be on the ballot. It will likely be a very complicated issue because of the Covenants expiration and could morph into some other legal complaint entirely.
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Post by Admin on Jan 7, 2014 18:41:53 GMT -5
This is Part I of the Unofficial Minutes of the Workshop which was transcribed "on the fly" from audio recording. Audio condition was poor but understandable with concentration. This was a long meeting and I have a headache from listening to the stylings of the Prez and trying not only to hear poor audio but the rambling and sometimes incomprehensible stream of thought. One word KL--punctuation! How about a "period" once in a while? I'll have to have a glass of merlot before I finish the recording.
BOD Workshop January 7, 2014
Roll call, passing minutes, Manager report.
KL: <<Extended Heavy sigh>>… I have several different things I will just mention in passing part; the idea of the workshop was to ___ ideas for consideration In the future or to be discussed in detail. One of the things I want to ask the board to look at is writing new rules & reg and sops for better terms for boat slips. There has been some individuals that don’t use it for months and months on and off and if you don’t use the boat dock for 60 consecutive days you should forfeit your space and your name goes to the bottom of the list assuming there is a list so maybe we ought to put that on the SOP. Guaranteed a spot someplace on there and there are different sizes and it shouldn’t make a difference unless you have an oversized boat. I ask the Board to think about it before we try to put something together. All the spots are the same and I don’t see why there is any difference. Think about it before we put something together.
A memorial wall in this H all..in this building; I don’t feel the board should be the one making those decisions, they get all kinds of flack; it needs to come from the owners and since we know how easy it is to get people to volunteer for committees do something, I’d ike to address that from the standpoint that there will be a set up to look at these thing and the____ a committee will be composed of the presidents of all the groups in SLR you would all be in the committee and you can choose your chairman, president or whatever and I would suggest you meet once or twice a season and anyone to make a suggestion go to the committee member and suggest if we need a plaque to be a uniform size and design. It puts it back out there with the people who are involved and it should be out of our hands. Other speaker: We ought to try have an honorary wall rather than a memorial wall for a person who has passed away because the intention is to honor people who have gone outside of the usual for the resort and gave up their time with no compensation and they should be honored and some people who don’t do nothing. Suggestion at this point to make a motion to put it into effect. In the meantime we can talk about it, think about it and asked for comments from board and audience. Audience member: What is the use of having memorial gardens if we make this a memorial wall? KL: We call this Memorial H all but people objected to it and we talked about it for 6 months and asked for suggestions; we asked for input and a memorial wall is something different from memorial gardens. Audience member: How much space will the wall take up? KL: Up to the committee. Assuming the placques are normal size 12’ x 10 max, you can get quite a few placques up. Some audience positive comment about lobby at LW Memorial Hospital. We are honoring so and so because they did this and this we would not put up more than 2 or 3 a year at the most. After a certain length would not think you would add 10-12 placques a year especially since it’s so hard to get people to volunteer. Put something together and make a motion.
O kaaaaay the other item I wanted to mention was that we had made motion at last meeting to put on the ballot to owners a choice on the internet and the board did not make a decision saying you must to this, that and the other but owners are the ones who should make these decisions. But we tried to put it on the ballot but we had a group of many many many people and at least 20 sent in form letters all same form letter—that we couldn’t do that. The question was raised if we can legally do that which raised a question and when a question like that is raised we decided to spend lawyer money to get an attorney and find out who’s right and who’s wrong. I think we’re right and we have the right to do it. Otherwise we are saying the board had no authority to approve the _______ to the resort___ and giving money to outside corporation-not owned by S-bag--that’s true. But the only example I can think of to possibly come up with is in the past the fact that there is only one way out of here. IN Pennsylvania in the newspaper the other day there was a container truck of gasoline in the passing lane and the road was closed for 18 hours and if that happens outside our gate we are stuck for 18 hours or however long it takes to clean up and may be would be an inconvenience to some or a life threatening situation with people needing medical attention. Maybe we could work out a deal with one of our neighbors to allow us an emergency exit and Ok If we found someone to do that certain people would say we have to paint the road but we can’t do that because we can’t spend money on property that doesn’t belong to us. And that doesn’t even make sense and that is the only example I can think of. ¬We cannot spend resort money to provide service unless the resort owns the whole thing.
In light of that, some of us made a motion to rescind that motion we made at the last meeting for the 2 different possibilities for the budget-- will anybody do that? New motion made: Our attorney has decided to research to determine how to present the question of presenting to the owners with option to obtain service, I PB motion that the option previously passed at Dec 18th meeting should … be rescinded. Discussion. Audience member asks BOD to clarify because they cannot hear… can’t hear what he was saying ”what little we can hear back here, we are confused— KL: we are talking about the wifi and making two options on budget but because these people said it was illegal we have to research it and need to rescind the motion and it will not be on the ballot. We are saying the attorney says they will have to research that and since we have to wait to research it we need to rescind the motion now. It’s not going to be $545/Q that we will be voting on; no wifi will be in the budget. Wifi is not attached to the budget. The budget puts us back to where we were 2 years ago before we reduced the budget. The only increase will be $25/Q. What happens to wifi? KL: No it’s not going to be in the budget the same way that it is now. It’s not an issue at this point. We have no say. Audience member: “Several years ago we borrowed money and we spend money to pay off the bill? Is it paid off? KL: It’s not paid off there are another couple years we are now paying in advance, paying it off faster that it needed. Motion Read: (Not word for word) “Our attorney has advised that research is needed to determine if the motion previously passed to add the option to the ballot to include a service not previously included in the annual assessment to the budget with or without internet fee be rescinded.” Motion carried to rescind the motion but sounded like one AYE after the “all in favor” AYE suggesting there was one dissenting vote. (Audio conditions difficult) That ends that option.
While we are talkin’ about the internet and since there are apparently people who feel we should’nt have it, don’t need it, don’t want it and think B is making a fortune off us-- but some questions may be legitimate questions but have not enough knowledge. Yes I’m sure Mr S has a cash flow problem; we pay nothing to a have security system in the storage area where there is a good chance if someone breaks into a vehicle or sheds it will show up. There is a camera at the pool that someone comes in there at night and does mischief or falls in at night. We pay nothing for that. And I know for a fact that the cameras are monitored 24 hours a day/7 days a week the company (presumably refers here to KCN) had to increase capacity in the resort to handle those signals and we didn’t pay for that. We paid for the cameras. Maintenance is taken care of. Do you like having a website? We have a website that is paid for and we do not pay a webmaster to keep it current. We pay nothing for that. Guess what the cost of that would be to keep it current. Do you like having church services available online; that will go away. We pay nothing for that. The KK meetings we pay nothing for that, the For Sale-- does she want to sell, or rent but some have used it; I’ve had friends contact me so I know people use it. A big thing and this is what started the whole thing; there is without this service no internet for maintenance area. How many people do you know that say _____ ..something about payroll and what are we gonna do have someone else set it up for us? Are we gonna shut it down? Take away the antenna there is nothing we can do about the antenna. So think about it people all the way around. Audience Member? Anyway we can get the company to charge us for cameras and put it in budget and charge us for services provided. If these things are provided and we pay then maybe K C N would provide wifi. KL: I don't think it would be a problem for the company to write contact and we don’t have a contract by the way. There is no contract. In business it’s one of those things and it’s probably not a good idea but most of us or all of us have a relationship with neighbors and maybe we could draw a contact and that’s a possibility. But I guarantee you there are people that will say <<raises voice and mocks >> “We don’t need no stinkin’ security” they are probably the same ones we caught in the past foro doing things you aren’t supposed to be doing. Those are the ones you hear screaming that they're harassing me out at night when I'm walking.,,yes you're darn right we are! (unintelligible rant)
I preached to the choir enough today.
Stay tuned for Part II!
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Post by Jr. Sample on Jan 7, 2014 20:03:37 GMT -5
This is Part I of the Unofficial Minutes of the Workshop which was transcribed "on the fly" from audio recording. Audio condition was poor but understandable with concentration. This was a long meeting and I have a headache from listening to the stylings of the Prez and trying not only to hear poor audio but the rambling and sometimes incomprehensible stream of thought. One word KL--punctuation! How about a "period" once in a while? I'll have to have a glass of merlot before I finish the recording. BOD Workshop January 7, 2014 Roll call, passing minutes, Manager report. KL: <<Extended Heavy sigh>>… I have several different things I will just mention in passing part; the idea of the workshop was to ___ ideas for consideration In the future or to be discussed in detail. One of the things I want to ask the board to look at is writing new rules & reg and sops for better terms for boat slips. There has been some individuals that don’t use it for months and months on and off and if you don’t use the boat dock for 60 consecutive days you should forfeit your space and your name goes to the bottom of the list assuming there is a list so maybe we ought to put that on the SOP. Guaranteed a spot someplace on there and there are different sizes and it shouldn’t make a difference unless you have an oversized boat. I ask the Board to think about it before we try to put something together. All the spots are the same and I don’t see why there is any difference. Think about it before we put something together. A memorial wall in this H all..in this building; I don’t feel the board should be the one making those decisions, they get all kinds of flack; it needs to come from the owners and since we know how easy it is to get people to volunteer for committees do something, I’d ike to address that from the standpoint that there will be a set up to look at these thing and the____ a committee will be composed of the presidents of all the groups in SLR you would all be in the committee and you can choose your chairman, president or whatever and I would suggest you meet once or twice a season and anyone to make a suggestion go to the committee member and suggest if we need a plaque to be a uniform size and design. It puts it back out there with the people who are involved and it should be out of our hands. Other speaker: We ought to try have an honorary wall rather than a memorial wall for a person who has passed away because the intention is to honor people who have gone outside of the usual for the resort and gave up their time with no compensation and they should be honored and some people who don’t do nothing. Suggestion at this point to make a motion to put it into effect. In the meantime we can talk about it, think about it and asked for comments from board and audience. Audience member: What is the use of having memorial gardens if we make this a memorial wall? KL: We call this Memorial H all but people objected to it and we talked about it for 6 months and asked for suggestions; we asked for input and a memorial wall is something different from memorial gardens. Audience member: How much space will the wall take up? KL: Up to the committee. Assuming the placques are normal size 12’ x 10 max, you can get quite a few placques up. Some audience positive comment about lobby at LW Memorial Hospital. We are honoring so and so because they did this and this we would not put up more than 2 or 3 a year at the most. After a certain length would not think you would add 10-12 placques a year especially since it’s so hard to get people to volunteer. Put something together and make a motion. O kaaaaay the other item I wanted to mention was that we had made motion at last meeting to put on the ballot to owners a choice on the internet and the board did not make a decision saying you must to this, that and the other but owners are the ones who should make these decisions. But we tried to put it on the ballot but we had a group of many many many people and at least 20 sent in form letters all same form letter—that we couldn’t do that. The question was raised if we can legally do that which raised a question and when a question like that is raised we decided to spend lawyer money to get an attorney and find out who’s right and who’s wrong. I think we’re right and we have the right to do it. Otherwise we are saying the board had no authority to approve the _______ to the resort___ and giving money to outside corporation-not owned by S-bag--that’s true. But the only example I can think of to possibly come up with is in the past the fact that there is only one way out of here. IN Pennsylvania in the newspaper the other day there was a container truck of gasoline in the passing lane and the road was closed for 18 hours and if that happens outside our gate we are stuck for 18 hours or however long it takes to clean up and may be would be an inconvenience to some or a life threatening situation with people needing medical attention. Maybe we could work out a deal with one of our neighbors to allow us an emergency exit and Ok If we found someone to do that certain people would say we have to paint the road but we can’t do that because we can’t spend money on property that doesn’t belong to us. And that doesn’t even make sense and that is the only example I can think of. ¬We cannot spend resort money to provide service unless the resort owns the whole thing. In light of that, some of us made a motion to rescind that motion we made at the last meeting for the 2 different possibilities for the budget-- will anybody do that? New motion made: Our attorney has decided to research to determine how to present the question of presenting to the owners with option to obtain service, I PB motion that the option previously passed at Dec 18th meeting should … be rescinded. Discussion. Audience member asks BOD to clarify because they cannot hear… can’t hear what he was saying ”what little we can hear back here, we are confused— KL: we are talking about the wifi and making two options on budget but because these people said it was illegal we have to research it and need to rescind the motion and it will not be on the ballot. We are saying the attorney says they will have to research that and since we have to wait to research it we need to rescind the motion now. It’s not going to be $545/Q that we will be voting on; no wifi will be in the budget. Wifi is not attached to the budget. The budget puts us back to where we were 2 years ago before we reduced the budget. The only increase will be $25/Q. What happens to wifi? KL: No it’s not going to be in the budget the same way that it is now. It’s not an issue at this point. We have no say. Audience member: “Several years ago we borrowed money and we spend money to pay off the bill? Is it paid off? KL: It’s not paid off there are another couple years we are now paying in advance, paying it off faster that it needed. Motion Read: (Not word for word) “Our attorney has advised that research is needed to determine if the motion previously passed to add the option to the ballot to include a service not previously included in the annual assessment to the budget with or without internet fee be rescinded.” Motion carried to rescind the motion but sounded like one AYE after the “all in favor” AYE suggesting there was one dissenting vote. (Audio conditions difficult) That ends that option. While we are talkin’ about the internet and since there are apparently people who feel we should’nt have it, don’t need it, don’t want it and think B is making a fortune off us-- but some questions may be legitimate questions but have not enough knowledge. Yes I’m sure Mr S has a cash flow problem; we pay nothing to a have security system in the storage area where there is a good chance if someone breaks into a vehicle or sheds it will show up. There is a camera at the pool that someone comes in there at night and does mischief or falls in at night. We pay nothing for that. And I know for a fact that the cameras are monitored 24 hours a day/7 days a week the company (presumably refers here to KCN) had to increase capacity in the resort to handle those signals and we didn’t pay for that. We paid for the cameras. Maintenance is taken care of. Do you like having a website? We have a website that is paid for and we do not pay a webmaster to keep it current. We pay nothing for that. Guess what the cost of that would be to keep it current. Do you like having church services available online; that will go away. We pay nothing for that. The KK meetings we pay nothing for that, the For Sale-- does she want to sell, or rent but some have used it; I’ve had friends contact me so I know people use it. A big thing and this is what started the whole thing; there is without this service no internet for maintenance area. How many people do you know that say _____ ..something about payroll and what are we gonna do have someone else set it up for us? Are we gonna shut it down? Take away the antenna there is nothing we can do about the antenna. So think about it people all the way around. Audience Member? Anyway we can get the company to charge us for cameras and put it in budget and charge us for services provided. If these things are provided and we pay then maybe K C N would provide wifi. KL: We don’t have a contract by the way. There is no contract. In business it’s one of those things and it’s probably not a good idea but most of us or all of us have a relationship with neighbors and maybe we could draw a contact and that’s a possibility. But I guarantee you there are people that will say <<raises voice and mocks >> “We don’t need no stinkin’ security” they are probably the same ones we caught doing things you aren’t supposed to be doing. Those are the ones you hear screaming ___________(unintelligible rant) I preached to the choir enough today. Stay tuned for Part II! IN Pennsylvania in the newspaper the other day there was a container truck of gasoline in the passing lane and the road was closed for 18 hours and if that happens outside our gate we are stuck for 18 hours or however long it takes to clean up and may be would be an inconvenience to some or a life threatening situation with people needing medical attention. Maybe we could work out a deal with one of our neighbors to allow us an emergency exit and Ok If we found someone to do that certain people would say we have to paint the road but we can’t do that because we can’t spend money on property that doesn’t belong to us. And that doesn’t even make sense and that is the only example I can think of. ¬We cannot spend resort money to provide service unless the resort owns the whole thing.
I don't know about anyone else but these seem like the ramblings of a madman !
I wonder if we could see a copy of that Pennsylvania newspaper article ?
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Post by BagLady on Jan 7, 2014 21:10:33 GMT -5
I wonder if this is it>> KL's gasoline truck fireI too wonder about KL's cognitive health after reviewing this audio. His diatribe on the overturned gasoline truck as some kind of example of the unreasonable restrictive conditions placed on SLohA by our covenants--a legitimate and validated concern stated by 100+ "some/certain people" who elected him as a leader--is almost too much to take in... And then there was the "we can't get along without cameras and updated information" provided by the "company" as he referred to K C N. (Supposedly, we don't pay for it.) Please--the only vandalism that occured at the storage lot was suspected to be a retaliatory act done by agents of MANBOD and the camera caught nothing. It was supposedly having the software updated. Convenient. As for information on CHUG provided by a "webmaster"--give me a break--it took eleven days to post the minutes of the December BOD meeting! And, CHUG is possibly one of the most sophomoric websites that I have seen in the last 10 years! KL has always rambled at meetings and driven listeners nuts but this meeting seems "more so". If KL is suffering the aftereffects of his illness then one can sympathize and appeal to the other directors to do what is necessary to relieve him of some of the burdens of his office. |
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Post by BR549 on Jan 7, 2014 21:25:40 GMT -5
Correct me if I am wrong , the Gasoline Truck Fire in the Passing Lane in the Pennsylvania news paper wasn't on the agenda . |
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Post by Grandpa Jones on Jan 7, 2014 22:01:12 GMT -5
Correct me if I am wrong , the Gasoline Truck Fire in the Passing Lane in the Pennsylvania news paper wasn't on the agenda . After reading KL's gasoline truck fire I can see how that story directly relates to the situation and the discussion of the internet and the ballot in SLR but only when I click my dentures together 3 times and say There's no place like Gnome .
I think that old boys cheese done slid off his cracker .
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Post by BagLady on Jan 8, 2014 6:25:54 GMT -5
Well that comment did it! I had just sat down with my coffee to check in with the forum and I read that and belly-laughed so hard I nearly dropped my java on my 'puter. My dog was startled by my unexpected reaction and scrambled across my lap to seek shelter, further endangering my laptop to my coffee cup's precarious state of equilibrium.
Last night, the news media alerted everyone to the possible Velveeta Cheese Shortage about to hit our cheese-hungry population! (Hey- it's more relevant here than than KL's gasoline truck fire story!)
You reminded me that there should be a warning label on this forum to not read while holding a beverage of any kind!
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Post by Admin on Jan 8, 2014 6:56:48 GMT -5
In beginning Part II of the meeting with "fresh ears" and no headache, I listened to the last part of the meeting to mark my start point and I heard something I didn't hear before...
Wow, I thought before that certain members of this BOD were unhinged but this is a truly shocking public acknowledgement. People "knew" who was stalking a lone female out walking her dog at night and who was lurking nearby and shining flashlights in her face and scaring her and spooking her dog. Now we KNOW for sure. This BOD is out of its mind and out of control.
I am making a duplicate copy of this audio and this BOD should hope that no harm or foul comes to anyone or their property in here who they target for this type of abusive treatment.
Please everyone wake up to what is going on in here.
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Post by Admin on Jan 8, 2014 7:26:20 GMT -5
This is very close to a word-for-word. Listen to what he is suggesting. He intends, with the help of the attorney, to find a way to get the internet fee in the budget in a different way than it is now (proposed)--at some future point.
We will have to see what the attorney comes up with, but whatever it is, it should be suspect and scrutinized. KL has put owners on notice--this IS going to be rammed down owner' throats in some fashion and through some manipulative means.
And if anyone remains so naive as to believe that there is no self-serving agenda, then I have a business proposition I would like to offer you...
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Post by Resident Guest on Jan 8, 2014 7:40:16 GMT -5
In beginning Part II of the meeting with "fresh ears" and no headache, I listened to the last part of the meeting to mark my start point and I heard something I didn't hear before... Wow, I thought before that certain members of this BOD were unhinged but this is a truly shocking public acknowledgement. People "knew" who was stalking a lone female out walking her dog at night and who was lurking nearby and shining flashlights in her face and scaring her and spooking her dog. Now we KNOW for sure. This BOD is out of its mind and out of control. I am making a duplicate copy of this audio and this BOD should hope that no harm or foul comes to anyone or their property in here who they target for this type of abusive treatment. Please everyone wake up to what is going on in here. I am glad that KL has made it public that he in fact IS harassing my wife and admits to it . I would request a copy of this audio and will be paying a visit to the Polk County Sheriffs Dept. Then to the Lawyer to start proceedings against KL personally as this is above and beyond his fiduciary duty as a BOD KL IS NOT INDEMNIFIED IN THIS INSTANCE . . KL is on notice .
I would ask that KL defend his position to describe exactly what this woman walking her dog has been CAUGHT DOING and his reason for stalking and harassing an over 55 year old woman with a disability and at night who is doing what any resident has a right to do.
There has been no notice or contact whatsoever from KL or any other member of the BOD claiming any wrong doing to this Female Resident, NO contact from any Law Enforcement Officers with a complaint against said Female Resident walking her dog at night .
Mr. KL had better have his poop in a group at this point in time as he is on notice with me and I will have a discussion with him face to face about this .
KL will not be able to tell me to sit down but he can , and I assume he will be a coward and NOT be willing to defend his statement.
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Post by BagLady on Jan 8, 2014 8:02:41 GMT -5
Resident Guest Guest--identify yourself to me and I will get a clip of the audio to you. The words cannot be denied.
Looks like KL better "lawyer up"--probably ALL the directors should. This is a group effort and he was not the only one involved. He is just the ringleader encouraging and permitting it. He should be recalled.
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Guest Resident Identification
Guest
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Post by Guest Resident Identification on Jan 8, 2014 8:51:46 GMT -5
In beginning Part II of the meeting with "fresh ears" and no headache, I listened to the last part of the meeting to mark my start point and I heard something I didn't hear before... Wow, I thought before that certain members of this BOD were unhinged but this is a truly shocking public acknowledgement. People "knew" who was stalking a lone female out walking her dog at night and who was lurking nearby and shining flashlights in her face and scaring her and spooking her dog. Now we KNOW for sure. This BOD is out of its mind and out of control. I am making a duplicate copy of this audio and this BOD should hope that no harm or foul comes to anyone or their property in here who they target for this type of abusive treatment. Please everyone wake up to what is going on in here. I am glad that KL has made it public that he in fact IS harassing my wife and admits to it . I would request a copy of this audio and will be paying a visit to the Polk County Sheriffs Dept. Then to the Lawyer to start proceedings against KL personally as this is above and beyond his fiduciary duty as a BOD KL IS NOT INDEMNIFIED IN THIS INSTANCE . . KL is on notice .
I would ask that KL defend his position to describe exactly what this woman walking her dog has been CAUGHT DOING and his reason for stalking and harassing an over 55 year old woman with a disability and at night who is doing what any resident has a right to do.
There has been no notice or contact whatsoever from KL or any other member of the BOD claiming any wrong doing to this Female Resident, NO contact from any Law Enforcement Officers with a complaint against said Female Resident walking her dog at night .
Mr. KL had better have his poop in a group at this point in time as he is on notice with me and I will have a discussion with him face to face about this .
KL will not be able to tell me to sit down but he can , and I assume he will be a coward and NOT be willing to defend his statement.
We are James & Carol Grnt plus One Black Labrador Dog . |
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Post by Harrassed Resident on Jan 8, 2014 10:08:29 GMT -5
Resident Guest Guest--identify yourself to me and I will get a clip of the audio to you. The words cannot be denied. Looks like KL better "lawyer up"--probably ALL the directors should. This is a group effort and he was not the only one involved. He is just the ringleader encouraging and permitting it. He should be recalled. Just a side note, I was able to burn the Audio File of KL's (bod pres.) statement of the meeting to Disc .
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Post by Admin on Jan 9, 2014 9:41:39 GMT -5
This next part is one for the record book (and possibly the court room!) I am making duplicate safe copies of this meeting. Is is the most incredible thing I have ever heard.
This board, along with K C N, seems to be actively advocating for suppression of any disagreement to their internet plan by members! (I should probably expect an attack against me about the forum.) Incredibly, even MK explained to them they should not forge ahead prematurely and they ignored her advice! She should also explain the concept of "breach of fiduciary" and that it is not covered by the D&O insurance.
Short story: these people rescinded the previously-rescinded motion to take the internet budget option off the ballot. It's back on the ballot (unless the attorney and MK give them a smack-down).
By the way--shout out to P B who is the only director who said NO to this preposterous motion.
I have another headache and am about half way done Part II.
Believe me when I say it will be worth reading!
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Post by Admin on Jan 9, 2014 21:23:53 GMT -5
January 7, 2014 Part II of III
(Continuation)
PB: <Unintellible conversation> Office committee where we’re at <Interruption> Can everybody hear what he said? Several NO’s from audience…14th meeting the sign committee at the office about the sign and progress at the next board meeting. KL: So if anyone has suggestion. Mumbling…..Here goes KL again (mocking): “Who decided to do this? “
Member: How many letters is it gonna take to stop that? We only have 20 letters to stop the internet-- how many to stop the sign? Two. I don’t understand how you can let 20 letters do that. You have …..here…overtalking KL: The 20 letters raised an issue that the attorney couldn’t say for certain didn’t they did’nt have an element of fact or an element of truth. It’s a question. I think in the long run we could have done it but I don’t know… where do you draw the line? Another member asks question—<<much shouting and overtalking. Unintelligible conversation with female member asking question>>. Can’t hear what she is saying.
KL: On the way down here this morning, I had Sirius radio on my car and there I had it tuned to 40 stations if that is appropriate there are people in here that never hear anything beyond the 40’s. Member: Interesting that the first letter we received was from somebody said that our R & R don’t cover us being able to put it on the ballot and is probably one that has probably violated more laws in here than any one else and goes 40 mpg by my place and goes through stop signs. That person should get arrested and ….rule book. You can do what you want I guess. KL: There is a situation where a certain individual --I don’t want to single anyone out-- saying that we should do away with the antennas in here for the internet, but yet the same person proposes that why don’t we broadcast live at the board meetings we have the capability …...so which is it?
Anyone else? BS: I have 3 little things. #1 for those that think we make a profit on this on the 15th of each month I put in between $20-700K into the company account to pay expenses for previous month. There has been no month-- zero-since this whole thing started that that we have not funded the company. Jan 15th is approaching. What do you think my mood is? Number 2 We were upwards of .. said ..My internet stopped working this morning. It was May 31. If we are gonna solve that we have to act quickly. We spent 3 weeks hunting for anyone else…we could possibly get to get things solves—Brighthouse-- and we couldn’t even have a board meeting. The only choice..I looked at it as an investment banker--worst choice in the world- never get back your money! Why did we decide to do that? Because we cared about S-bag and we saw a vision of what S-bag can be but 20 people conspired to remove the majority’s rights to vote. That is contrary to federal law. The attorneys will be supoenaing those forms Monday and a suit in a federal court against those 20 forms will be filed on Tuesday << loud clapping>> PB One comment; we didn’t take it off the ballot because of the 20 people’s letters…. BS interrupts: I do not fault the board at all. If you were wrong, there was a way to have it solved later. But the way it has been handled at the last minute when you had no time you were handed a choice where you were probably, in my mind, had no choice but to remove it. So I do not blame S-bag or the board but I do see this as a very clearly perfect …conspiracy, even if they had legal rights and that form reeks of advice from amateur attorney or somebody that says he ’s a real one. Either way, I have forfeited their actions …and the harm that their actions caused us.
KL: Ok can we move on then. Comment Member: Is there any reason that we as a board could not make a yes or no on the budget and include the internet fee? You let 20 people stop 700 people from voting on the internet. That’s just wrong… the people need the right to choose,. BS: My purpose is to have it raised again is we are going to stop expanding soon and I need to know if we keep staff long enough to build it up or not so as far as our expansion into SLR, it isn’t going to happen. I think that something the people deserve to have raised but I want to make sure I didn’t’ have something done and that choice has been denied by 20 votes that ..own personal business and I don’t dispute their own reasons- I don’t care if they have aircard …to have it and some of the people deserve the right to. I want to make sure the majority had a fair choice and that has been denied by a few people and I don’t care if they have air cards. The majority got the chance..moving on. You can’t make anything here that somebody didn’t want. The majority should get the right to choose. Motion that we reconsider this. Practically, don’t you have a time when the ballots need to be printed? KL: That’s the problem; the time it takes and you don’t have the time to solve the problem that caused the board to say we gotta pass. Member: Seems to me that the attorney has told us about researching it that people should still be making determination as to what they want and I look at the R & R and bylaw and articles and wonder and how much stuff is run by attorney. BS: Four years ago I sent copy of bylaw to my attorney that ….but we have lived with that problem for years. I’m going to solve it all….I had hoped that my vision of how it was going to be a wide channel was gonna happen but it’s not going to happen now…so that’s it.
BOD director: One of the reasons why I have changed my opinion of that motion we had this morning is that on second thought the attorney has not told us either way--he has not told us that it is illegal. Why can’t we therefore take the advice of the very thoughtful people in the management company who said we could do this? I think we should do it and let the chips fall. It is long past due for the tail wagging the dog in this organization.
(Editor Note: HISSY FIT ALERT AHEAD!!!)
If you excuse my French, but I’ve sat here and bit my Tang and have become part of the silent majority and I know they’re out there…stressing the majority.. the SILENT MAJORITY. We’re here to represent the MAJORITY with all due respect and my French: I don’t give a rat’s ass what this group of brats has to say. I’m more concerned what the majority has to say. I’d like to reconsider that motion and put it back on the ballot and let the chips fall where they may. I’ll go for that. I’ll agree.
Do you want to make a motion to rescind the motion that was rescinded? How much time do we have to get this on the ballot? Since the ballot hasn’t been printed yet at this point, it is a few days before it has to go to the printer and we have to have it out in the mail to be in the mail by the 15th or before that.
Member: I really don’t’ see what the issue is other than it’s not in our bylaws that you can do that --people in here who want service from KCN it have and people in here that that don’t want it don’t have it-- so why are you trying to force people who don’t want it to have it? It’s like Obamacare—a lot of people don’t want it and they ram it down their throat…you are going to divide people in here that don’t even have a computer and the Board says it’s for the good of all. Protest from KL: Its NOT TRUE! Member It IS TRUE. KL: Who knows what the technology is going to be 2 or 3 years from now; the service that KCN provides might be old school and there will be something much better. Member: So leave these people alone! KL continues on: On the other hand it might not be available any other way. Member: Guy got up said he wouldn’t move into a place without internet. Well he has it and people carry their own internet service with them. That service is here! KL: That’s true. But people who want movies or TV can only use antenna and you can’t get satellite or cable except through the internet and you can’t get internet….Member : Not true, I don’t think the sat companies are going out of business because of the internet. SS: It’s what the majority wants. It’s no different than if we decide to put in a bocce ball court—First member protests…SS: shouts “Be Quiet and sit down and let me talk! I’m talking. Shut up, sit down and let me talk!” Member: Oh yeah. SS: It’s no different than any amenity we want to add- if it’s not here now it’s something new. The majority of people deserve the right to make the decision--not 20 people. Member: Not true. You are supposed to represent ALL of us! Unknown rude person: “Be quiet”.
Member: I‘d like to bring up the point that if we go back on the ballot it’s not shoo-in. It still has to be voted on and the majority rules. Let the majority rule. KL: There is something in this society that we are moving away from and that is the majority does not rule any more. Member: I want to comment on the budget process , the board has the power to put things in the budget if they want to include this and if people don’t want it they can vote it down. I go back two years ago when I was on the board and there was a grass roots movement or whatever and the budget did not pass and it is not too much different from this process where you want to add the internet and if people don’t like it they get together and vote it down and you have to go back and do it over. <<Something about democracy>> Some member comment about people making noise but one of the things I find go on in the park and we have no voice in the things that were put in here originally but ...beautiful beautiful ..so we are looking at the situation the whole place is beautiful…the people who are buying whatever but we still rule by democracy and that’s why I think it should stay on the ballot but I think everything should be on the ballot not just this internet. Expenditures should be on the ballot.
KL: One last time. BS: As I see it, the board in its wisdom saw this might not be a popular thing and made two options to choose between them. I have had several phone calls …I want high speed and it is better to allow a way to choose between the two and it allows folks to say this is what I’m in favor of. I don’t care …but in terms of majority ruling it seems to me that it is totally wrong to let 20 folks for some reason …I understand it the board doesn’t have the power to pass something new and if that is correct then we have broken that rule. MK: I’m gonna speak to what the attorney said that it wasn’t necessarily the second budget option on the ballot or the internet being added but situation as a whole between SLohA and KCN The attorney objections to the ballot option the situation as a whole there is no standing contract—there is only an invoicing situation. Unless you get into a situation like this-you have to have to have a standard contract in place; what is free, what is charged, what is expected of the corp etc. They’re main consideration is liability where the association is concerned. They need documentation. They are not saying it is not legal; they are saying they need time to determine that the board is not making a mistake. Then you are back to square one anyway. Protecting the corp from liability is their main concern. There is no contract--they have nothing to research-- they are trying to make sure the board is not making a mistake and trying to ratify a budget that cannot be enforced.
Member: One thing you are missing; we are not saying we are taking KCN service, we are saying do you want the service? You can work out the details later. MK: Attorneys don’t work out the details later --you must have the details up front. It is my job to tell you this. BS: But there is another thing; there is no negotiation that I didn’t start with a blank page. Walk in and you want this and that. Appropriate the money first, iron out a project second, get approved by attorneys third. There is no other process and for the attorney to say that they have to see the contract first is a waste of time.
KL: We have spent enough time on discussion. Motion to rescind the motion—to put it back on the ballot. We already made a motion to rescind the previously-rescinded motion. <<Unintelligible talking by many people.>> Another motion by CJ J to add option to ballot to vote for the budget with or without resort wide internet. Discussion. Vote: PB NO all others Yes. Motion carries.
Correspondence anything other than those 20 or so letters. Just read one of the 20. Do you want me to read the names” Yes. Read the names: total of 32 . Read the letters; they are all the same. Silence. Two more letters one from member requesting correction to draft minutes from last BOD meeting to include ALL owner comments and questions and one from owner with negotiating suggestions with K C N.
Part III to follow.
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Im Trying
Addict
" Chillin-Out " One Day At A Time !
Posts: 143
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Post by Im Trying on Jan 10, 2014 4:41:58 GMT -5
What a Circus... MK did a good job covering her companies butt. I am going to read this part 2, a couple more times, to take it all in. You know, there was some cheese on the annex floor. I am not sure who's cracker it slide off. But at least 3 members are on the list.
Please make (part 3 meeting adjourned). Will we get to read the outside on the annex steps informational conversations, with the old school senior residents. I hope so.
A Great Job & Well Done, It is Appreciated !!! Thank You Much.... Trying to transcribe this gibberish, is a big task... Again Thanks!!!
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Post by Fly on the Wall on Jan 10, 2014 7:19:03 GMT -5
What a Circus... MK did a good job covering her companies butt. I am going to read this part 2, a couple more times, to take it all in. You know, there was some cheese on the annex floor. I am not sure who's cracker it slide off. But at least 3 members are on the list. Please make (part 3 meeting adjourned). Will we get to read the outside on the annex steps informational conversations, with the old school senior residents. I hope so. A Great Job & Well Done, It is Appreciated !!! Thank You Much.... Trying to transcribe this gibberish, is a big task... Again Thanks!!! Did it seem to you that the panel having the discussion spent more time pointing fingers and making false and erroneous accusations than they did actually defending their position on the Ballot/Internet Proposal ?
This bunch cant seem to stay on point and I doubt this was the first time it has gone like it did .
How unfair to the Community to have such a babbling bunch of childish people pretending to be important and making decisions that affect how our community operates. Very Disappointing and aggravating to adults that see how inept this Board truly is .
I must give props to PB and MK , at least they don't have cotton candy for brain cells .
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Post by MoneyPenny on Jan 10, 2014 7:57:58 GMT -5
Let's review.
Mangement is here to "execute our reserves".
K C N is planning to "appropriate our money first"
Board is going to spend every dime in our reserves on legal fees "for the good of the community".
Is that right?
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Post by Memorex on Jan 10, 2014 8:08:24 GMT -5
Let's review. Mangement is here to "execute our reserves". K C N is planning to "appropriate our money first" Board is going to spend every dime in our reserves on legal fees "for the good of the community". Is that right? Yes, that is accurate ! Many of us heard those statements with our own ears . |
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Post by BagLady on Jan 10, 2014 8:48:41 GMT -5
Is this a new governance business model born Jan 7th in SLR--executive action by "let the chips fall?"
I am shocked and appalled by this reckless board. You were advised by your legal counsel that the 32 letters had "elements of fact and truth" and to hold off to allow time for further research--the legal rationale was further explained to you by MK from the Management Company. Do you think your irresponsible and incomprehensible action will be regarded in hindsight, under future scrutiny, as prudent and defensible under the "business judgement rule"? You better lawyer up as I doubt that Tower Hill is going to pay for your geezer hissy fit under D&O. If it is required to defend this idiot board, we will be lucky to get D&O coverage in the future from anybody at any price!
And a word to KCN-the third member of the triumverate of BOD, S Ball and now K C Nt-are you seriously thinking that you have any reasonable basis to persecute Association members who write to their own elected board to object to actions taken by them? These letters were not addressed to you, did not question your actions nor did it accuse anybody of anything. It was characterized by the attorney as having "elements of truth and fact" and asked the Board to declare its authority, citing applicable SLohA covenants and bylaws. Are you saying that seeking judicial relief of a conspiracy to suppress the democratic process is something that is reasonable or is this just petulant "huff 'n puff"? If this is your response, owners will translate this to your future general conduct toward parties to any contract entered with K C N in the future and...buyer beware.
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